From: Myron Paine
To: KAHoenke
Cc: judy/s papergoods, Valdimar Samúelsson <valdimar, steve hilgren
Mon, 04 Feb 2019 17:52:21 -0000 (GMT
Judy,
Karl is an unique person. He is the only one I know who has stayed in touch with Valdimar, Steve, myself and Richard Thornton of the people of one fire.
Besides Karl has the talent to listen and find simple words to explain things. His "many people came in many boats from many places" comment is still as valid as when he first said it, over a decade ago.
I suggest that Steve, Valdimar, Richard and I are,all, worth 45 minutes of discussion. Karl himself should be worth another 45 minutes of summary. The ideas spawned by the discussion of the work of the four of us would be worthy of another 45 minutes of discussion by Karl himself. The discussion might be led by someone other than Karl, so he can pull himself together for the summary session,
I hope you can pull the AMERICA before Columbus session together.
All sessions of the Ancient American conferences are good, but this one may be one of the better ones.
Have a good one.
Myron
Mon, Feb 4, 2019 at 11:45 AM
Valdimar Samúelsson wrote:Myron.
Talking about Karls qoute if I understand you right "many people came in many boats from many places"
I copied this from Gudbrand site http://oldgreenland.com
'' Þann 18 Julí 1290 er öllum
Palestínumönnum í Englandi vísað úr landi, í allt 17000 manns í aðgerðinni''
He says. ''18 of July 1290 all Palestinian 17.000 in England were deported '' He believes they came to the new land or in to Hudson Bay. But sure it could be in other places, but was there another safe place.?
Whatever or whereever 17.000 is quite a bit. Palestinians if i understood Gudbrand right are the Jews.
Yes Karl would be right and sure this applies to many other people in that time era.
best
Valdimar.
PS some of Gudbrands material is in English.
From: Myron Paine
Monday,February 4, 2019 2:54 PM
To: Valdimar Samúelsson KAHoenke; judys papergoods; steve hilgrenSubject: Re: 2019 dates
Thanks for the info.
I wonder about the "Palestinians." I find it difficult to believe there were that many Jews in England. But the Catholic/protestant troubles did not start until after 1509.
We have evidence that Jews were were in America, (The Moses stone--Karl has a replica-- and other Hebrew script in the HOPEWELL culture.
Also the Cherokee have a strong tradition similar to the jews.)
So there may have been a larger migration of Jews than I think there was.
We are talking about over 1000 boats rowing into the "Cristian Sea" (Hudson Bay), up (going south) the Nelson River into Lake Winnipeg.
At the south end of Lake Winnipeg they went three ways.
But, if the Jews were headed to the HOPEWELL region, they may have gone east to Thunder Bay on Lake Supier. Then across Lake superior. Then into Lake Ontario and Lake Erie.
I think the known evidence fits together.
As an Agriculture Engineer, I have often thought the Newark Ohio complex was facilities for working a buffalo herd.
If I had known that maybe 17.000 Jews were in the region, I would have been more aggressive about my hypothesis.
When the English suppressed knowledge by omission they sure wiped out a lot of migration studies.
Have a good one
Myron
Feb 4, 2019, 7:53 PM
Steve to me, valdimar.samuelsson, Karl, Aidon, thowsen, FrodeIsn't it something of a commentary on our historical outlook at this late date that the suggestion of a Norse exploration and settlement of the Great Lakes region of America almost 1000 years ago is received with reserve?
Superficially the notion that the Vinland of the Vikings lay only on the Atlantic coast is perhaps allowable but only by ignoring the records and relic of our first white visitors is it justifiable.
Has not the whole Vinland debate been distinguished hereto - foremore by a welter of notions than by consideration of facts.
The Vikings of Greenland are shown sailing west into Hudson Strait, (Gunnungagap) across Hudson Bay, (their ''Outer Ocean'') down the west coast of Hudson Bay (with its low west shore) with it's vast beaches and barren shore, to the mouth of the Hayes River.
The fundamentals here set forth are reasonably beyond question, that Vinland was the Great Lakes area of America.
This does not argue that the Atlantic coast, or a portion of it was not included in the Vinland of the Norse.
The desire is merely to emphasize the argument for the Great Lakes Area as having been the territory occupied by the Norsemen.
The historical writers who seek to locate Vinland only on the Atlantic coast seam to be making unnecessary trouble for themselves.
How could Norse relics have been distributed all over the Great Lakes region if the Norsemen had not been there? Nowadays it should be the fashion to at least consider the facts.
It has been denied that they were the first white men to discover America or to settle in the Great Lakes Region. It has been doubted they crossed the Atlantic from Norway.
In 1903-4 an account of the finding in a muskeg of the remains of a Norse boat by men who were digging a North Dakota drainage ditch to connect with the Red River.
Holmn City,1938. He found a a layer of earth 12 feet over the water level, the rotted remains of a large boat with a rounded construction and large boat with bowed ends.
Self sown wheat (prairie grass) and No frost in winter must mean the Vikings had reached the prairie.
On an island far to the west the norsemen found a wooden corn barn.
(the promontory of Winlandia (A.k.a the long narrow strip of high ground in western minnesota. This is my question)
thanks steve
PS from Steve to ALL
This all quoted from;
James W. Curran May 1, 1939 from his book ''This Was Vinland'' The Great Lakes Region of America
Free version available online.
This guy agrees with us (or we with him) but he had figured this out 80 years ago. And all this was before the Newfoundland discovery too.
Archaeology news today reported CNN says that the 65 million natives killed in central and north and south America by the europeans caused climate change. I don't buy it. There were not 65 million alive or dead,, that's rather ridiculous too. I also don't believe the Mandans were welsh or from prince Maddok and that there were 17000 jews sailing to America too unless they walked on water,,,. I would rather believe in ghosts or Santa and the earth is flat. .''Napolan said history is a made up story others agree with''.
On Sun, Feb 3, 2019 at 10:47 AM KAHoenke <knkrhino@comcast.net> wrote:
Judy,
“In a pinch” I could present an update of their work on their behalf, or we could try to get Steve to join us, though he’s a bit “conf shy”. Would there be a place for such a presentation? If interested I will start assembling the appropriate info.
Karl & Katherine Hoenke
3049 Golden Rain Road #8
Walnut Creek, CA 94595
925-943-7718
8262 North Heights
Kelseyville, CA 95451
707-279-1615
Karl cell 925-202-3147
Katherine cell 925-548-7755
From:judyspapergoods@charter.net [mailto:judyspapergoods@charter.net]
Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2019 11:30 AM
To: 'KAH'
Subject: Re: 2019 dates
YAH! R! Major
Myron is quite a trooper sticking to his theme and making great progress.
Last we spoke a couple years ago, he said his traveling days were done, so no more speaking at
our AAPS conferences. Our loss.
Luv, jud
-----------------------------------------
From: "KAH"
To: judyspapergoods@charter.net
Cc:
Sent: Saturday February 2 2019 1:01:23PM
Subject: Re: 2019 dates
Thanks Judy. Sorry to learn of eye issues; never good. Just checking: is Lon’s address majot or major cloudrunner? A typo maybe? BTW, Steve Hilgren, Valdimar and Myron are making some great progress confirming “Vinland of the West” is Minnesota.
Sent from my iPhone
Karl Hoenke
...
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Valdimar Samúelsson
Feb 5, 2019, 7:46 AM (1 day ago)
to steve, me, Karl, Aidon, thowsen, Frode
I aggree with Steve especially after having had opportunity to work with Steve Dimarzo in RI and Judi in SD.
If we take Karlsefni for example but he did not sail in to or up St Lawrence river or fjörd see;. They had found some agriculture items on one of the islands in the delta or opening before the river entered the Gulf of St.L.
I always put question on that and sure answer my self. No Icelandic Explorer or settler would dear settle on other people land.
That would cost trouble and no gain of anybody. They had honor system.
For me this is the main issue in our sagas and can be seen in our Landnáma book. . We had very few men from Norway that did try some with success some not but recorded as evil person.
Now what people dis such recording.?
17 thousands Jews is ridiculous but still possible if we take eourope had deported them and sure Britain ( england) could not take in such and feed them. Irish had fleet of ships that seemed to have come to Iceland both selling and buying and still our farm and mountain names say like Irish Harbor and Irish this and that. With Irish on Whitemansland it would be scholarly type stupitnes to even think Irisher would not do commerce with their fellow citizens over there.
In Lewis and Clark one elderly or Chief said to them one old man was 100 winters old. This was always said in Iceland both about human and animals.
The only way for Nordics or I would like to say Icelanders as those Icelanders in the mid west of MN and ND had settled before King of Norway in 1262 took Iceland, Greenland and people moving south so they had no right to take those lands but still he had Knudsen expedition claim lands settled by Icelanders by setting the KRS where it is.
Now I may sound like lunatic. :-) anyway lets continue. Remember we have all those cairns pointing towards Minnesota area.
Best Valdimar.
steve hilgren
Feb 5, 2019, 7:57 AM (1 day ago)
to wmsmithrock1@yahoo.com, Vang, Valdimar, Karl, Frode, Aidon, me, thowsen@msn.com
Thank you
From: Valdimar Samúelsson <valdimar.samuelsson@simnet.is>
Sent: Tuesday, February 5, 2019 7:46 AM
To: steve hilgren
Cc: Myron Paine; Karl Hoenke; Aidon Aakelas; thowsen@msn.com; Frode Omdahl
Subject: Re: ''This Was Vinland'' the Great Lakes Region of America''
I aggree with Steve especially after having had opportunity to work with Steve Dimarzo in RI and Judi in SD.
If we take Karlsefni for example but he did not sail in to or up St Lawrence river or fjörd see;. They had found some agriculture items on one of the islands in the delta or opening before the river entered the Gulf of St.L.
I always put question on that and sure answer my self. No Icelandic Explorer or settler would dear settle on other people land.
That would cost trouble and no gain of anybody. They had honor system.
For me this is the main issue in our sagas and can be seen in our Landnáma book. . We had very few men from Norway that did try some with success some not but recorded as evil person.
Now what people dis such recording.?
17 thousands Jews is ridiculous Irish had fleet of ships that seemed to have come to Iceland both selling and buying and still our farm and mountain names say like Irish Harbor and Irish this and that. With Irish on Whitemansland it would be scholarly type stupitnes to even think Irisher would not do commerce with their fellow citizens over there.
...
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